Middle Set on Monotone board

[jamtay317]

I found myself in a very interesting spot today playing online.

I was wondering what are your thoughts about this?

https://www.cardschat.com/replayer/4qfnGeD

[Dilly]

I'd love to see a video or homework assignment going over this kind of spot. Against competent opponents who will likely continue with more than just made flushes I think we definitely want to be betting, conventional wisdom says big because our opponent can connect in so many ways, but I wonder if going big lets our opponents only continue with flushes? But we definitely want to charge the draws. Here we see opponents continue with more than the made flush so we definitely can't just be giving up on these boards, but if we bet flop, and they raise as they did we're priced into call, then once we get to the turn it's pretty easy for the made flushes to price us in all the way....dont know that we want to turn our sets into bluff catchers here.....I don't have good answers lol

[GodsBigToe]

When we are super deep, I tend to check back the set on this board. Getting raised really sucks. Especially if there is a raise and a call. We know there is a turn bet coming given that action and we have no real idea where we are at. Just gets super awkward. When we check we can then flat and keep pots under control. If this went bet bet bet I think I am likely calling off but when it is 3 ways and goes bet, raise, call. and then Bet, jam on the turn, I dont think there are any single pair hands out there any more. The bare Ah is probably not going completely nuts and is pot controlling at some point . I would be very wary.

[Dilly]

Stack size is definitely a huge factor, at what depth/SPR do you think we should be comfortable getting it all in with our sets on monotone flops?

[GodsBigToe]

In a cash game to be honest I am not sure if it is a little different. I am almost solely a MTT player. Would be a good one to throw in discord and tag JustGTO. He is my resident goto for all things cash game. In a MTT I think around 20 bbs or so, maybe up to 30 I would just be trying to get this all in.

[MOUSE85]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I6A...Q1muKfVmCgUrJI

Kanu7 just did a couple free vids on monotone boards.
When your range has far more very strong hands than your opponent's range, you're generally going to want to bet big with those strong hands (and the appropriate number of bluffs for balance). On the other hand...

When your range contains far fewer very strong hands than your opponent's range, you're generally going to be limited to betting small.

There are other factors to consider, of course, but the rules of thumb above are a great starting point.
Alex concluded the video by going over the main takeaways:

• Big advantage at the top of the ranges → Bet bigger size.
• Most of our hands that want to bet are weaker → Bet smaller size.
• No big advantage at the top of the ranges → Not using big sizes.
• On monotone flops, use a default strategy of c-betting half the time for a 25-33% pot sizing.

If you want to hear each of these takeaways explained in greater detail, watch at least the last 2.5 minutes of Alex's video.

[radubalaj]

I would have bet the flop as well, probably similar size. The turn should be a disciplined fold. One player must have the flush there. You get 25% odds on your call, but will only get there 20% of the time with your boat.

[thereitis]

I would have bet the flop as well, probably similar size. The turn should be a disciplined fold. One player must have the flush there. You get 25% odds on your call, but will only get there 20% of the time with your boat.

I don't think this is correct. You need to call 4.51 to win a pot that has 21.03 in it. You are putting in 4.51 / ( 21.03 + 4.51 ) = 17.6% of the total pot after you call. You win roughly 20% of the time. So the call is profitable even if you assume he has the flush every time. If it's even remotely possible you are ahead some small % of the time, ... e.g, against Ah Ad then it becomes even more profitable.

[radubalaj]

Thanks for the correction. Must have made a mistake when calculating. So yes, calling would be correct here then.