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Interesting spot on river

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  • Interesting spot on river

    So I found my self in a bad spot by squeezing preflop.

    I think that I should have just called and seen a flop.

    Once I got 4bet pre, I really didn't like any options I had him on AK, QQ+. I will note, the reason for the call on the flop was I have an 80% c-bet on the flop and 30% c-bet on the turn.
    so he seems to play very straight forward on turn according to stats.

    I was hoping he checked the river where I could check behind, but when he shoved and checked the turn I only thought he could have AK.

    Let me know your thought process about this hand. What would you do?

  • #2
    First of all, why are you 3betting so small preflop? Maybe villain would not have 4bet you otherwise. You give everyone a good price to call, in case no one 4bets.
    I don't see anything wrong with squeezing here, besides the size.

    I would then fold to the 4bet. Even against AK you don't fare very well.

    Let's be honest, you could not get a better flop. Any J+ would have been bad.
    What I don't understand is why you did not bet the turn when the reason you got in the hand was the villain was honest on the turn?

    He noticed weakness in your play and shoved. I honestly don't know what the best play is here. Sometimes you'll be right calling a shove, but not sure if enough to justify calling. It's definitely a polarization bet, as you would not really want to bet that big if you wanted to get value from a weaker hand.


    • jamtay317
      jamtay317 commented
      Editing a comment
      why bet the turn? You have a marginal hand, I don't want to bluff, but I don't think I'm getting value from less. when he checks the turn, he now never has AQ, KK, AA. being that he is straight forward on the turn, with that leaves AK. is AK calling a bet. if we bet what size do we bet all in I don't think AK is calling that. if we bet 1/3 and he check-raises well now he could have QQ KK AA again. and our hand now goes way down in value. now we're in a bad spot.

    • radubalaj
      radubalaj commented
      Editing a comment
      Makes sense, but my thinking is that you bet so that the opponent folds overcards. Otherwise you give him a free card.
      This is in light of the fact that he plays honestly on the turn. He would have bet with QQ, KK and AA.

  • #3
    Raise bigger preflop

    This call on the river is only succesful 10-20 % of the time in my experience

    Dont do this as a default

    When villian only Checks turn and blasts river i am wondering whether he played the nuts this way , probably not but people make weird stuff, be careful


    • #4
      like the way u played

      I always prefer smaller sizing .. leaves more room for postflop

      what was going through your mind when deciding to hero river ? this is a line we see more and more now... curious if it works as well in cash


      • jamtay317
        jamtay317 commented
        Editing a comment
        I felt chchecking turn capped his range. So I didn't felt like AK was only possible holding.

      • CrazyEddie Reloaded
        CrazyEddie Reloaded commented
        Editing a comment
        fortune hates a coward
        Last edited by CrazyEddie Reloaded; 01-11-2020, 11:52 PM.

    • #5
      i dont see anything wrong or things worth to discuss, will villain check when they have AA or KK some might some might not , who know . in the end your TT is just a bluff catcher . calculate your pot odd and see hand hand vs his all in range and compare , if you hit your pot odd just catch. only you are there able to judge your opponent what is his range , without telling us opponent range we are as good a blind man touching the elephant .
      i also dont like to 3 bet utg much , but the stupid mp call in , i will 3 bet a small percent of the time. UTG range is strong , our TT is either a flip or way behind , and when he 4 bet i dont see much 99 there .
      i also dont think AQ is in utg range , AA KK AK QQ, i dont think JJ will jam there, we winning 16 combo of AK, lose to 6 combo AA, 6 combo KK and 3 combo of QQ. i really think you should call the all in on river, i dont see AQ 4 bettting at utg , but villain might not 4 bet all his AK so we are assuming he 4 bet all his AK, maybe in actual fact he may only 4 bet AKs so , you might only be lucky this time just happen hit his bluff


      • #6
        I have a question. What makes TT a better hand to squeeze here vs. calling? From how I'm (currently) looking at it, TT has a lot of equity against callers range, and a decent amount against most opener's range as well (depending on opening range of course). TT post flop plays well on a lot of boards, especially against someone who plays the turn very straight forward.

        Squeezing with a hand like TT puts us in a tough spot when we're 4bet since we have so much equity we almost have to call against the majority of players when caller in MP folds. And in situations where MP calls the 4bet, we're folding a really strong hand against their range since we're almost always behind.

        Wouldn't squeezing with something like T8s, J9s be better since when we're 4bet we can fold these hands without a second thought, plus when we're called we can play a lot of flops IP very easily?



        • jamtay317
          jamtay317 commented
          Editing a comment
          TT is a hand that does well vs 1 Player, but vs 2 players it doesn't fair very well.

          When were 4bet, yes puts us in a tough spot, but he raises 1.82 so we need to call 1.82 to win a pot of 6.07 so I'm getting 3:1 on a call and he 10x the bet behind. So in my opinion it's a on easy call.

          Now let's talk about T8s and J9s, I feel those play better postflop and I wouldn't 3bet. I would just rather see a flop in position

        • thereitis
          thereitis commented
          Editing a comment
          These microstakes games tend to be very high rake. I think in high rake situations, you want to win pots preflop as much as possible. So you should be calling much less and 3betting much more. We have some GTO online 6max charts that members have access to. In those charts, you will see there is very little calling and much more 3betting.

          Getting this hand to be heads up significantly improves your chances of winning. The other problem with calling is you are inviting many other people to call too when you call. So this could easily be a 5way pot on the flop that you rarely win.

      • #7
        I don't think the squeeze is necessarily bad. I think calling flop to see what develops is fine considering he can have AK and AQs at least that would c-bet the flop that we beat. When he checks the turned Q, AK becomes a lot of his range-- because of that I think the river call is probably good.


        • #8
          jamtay317 Nicely done. I like the 3bet preflop. I think you could go a little bigger but it's not necessary since you'll have position postflop.

          I mean that's about as good of a flop for TT as we could ask for. Turn, I think the villain gives a lot of information away about his range when he checks as I don't think villain's checking over-pairs. And at this point, we are left with about a pot-sized bet on the river, which makes this is a slam dunk call.

          So yeah, I like how you played this, I would have played it the same way. A river check from villain would be too easy. I like that he jammed his stack in there. I think it would have been a better play on the turn though, then you would have had a decision to make! lol nicely done.


          • #9
            Awesome! Thanks again for the information everyone. I definitely appreciate it. With out your help I wouldn't have done so well in the tournament I played in tonight. I finished 4th out of 111.