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Aces out of position

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  • Aces out of position

    Here's the hand. I decided to leave my river decision out of it. Do you guys call?
    Also I'm pretty sure my down bet on the flop is bad, I guess I'm thinking I want to under-rep my hand? What would your strategy be on the flop here?

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  • #2
    I like the flop bet. But I think I would shove facing his raise.

    We lose to 3 combos of JJ, 3 combos of TT, and 2 combos of JTs. That gives us a total of 8.

    I don't think it's unrealistic for AJ and QQ to be played in this way by him, both of which will pay us off. Already we have 12 total combinations of these.

    We also clean up our equity when he folds his 4 98s suited combos and weak J/T type hands. He probably will call with his KQ combos but we block the straight here very well.


    • #3
      Full disclosure, I think we’ve found a format for posting a hand I like even less than the replayer.

      I think as played you have to call on this specific river. Yes his 98 got there and you’re still losing to JJ and TT, but I think he has enough KQ, QQ, AJ and now counterfeited JT to balance that out. (You also obviously still lose to 33 but reducing combos of his most likely set is the other thing that makes this river so nice.)

      I don’t think I’d raise flop here as London suggests. I want to keep in his bluffs but as importantly keep in his overvalues. For all we know this guy plays J9 this way. I don’t want to do anything to stop him from doing that.
      Last edited by RealJPB; 01-04-2020, 09:49 AM.


      • commented
        Editing a comment
        Which way to prefer hand reviews to be done?

      • RealJPB
        RealJPB commented
        Editing a comment
        I’m an old (36 lol) fogey and I just like reading the hand in text form. Often when people include a replayer they don’t include anything else, particularly info about the villain.

    • #4
      We're going to assume that you and the villain are using fundamentally sound ranges here, as we have no info on the villain and need to assume that they play well.

      I understand that this is very narrow ranges, but BB 3bet vs UTG call 3bet are the ranges that I'm using here, you can look these ranges up using our 100BB charts.

      I will type what My thoughts are of this then I will run Piosolver on this and display the results.

      My first thought of the flop play is that I didn't like the small size of your raise. I would like to bet unfrequent, and large here, something like 4.00.
      When you're raised on the flop I really don't see any option but to call. I don't want to raise, and I don't want to fold.

      Yeah on the turn, I think just calling is correct, try to pot control and get to showdown.

      On the river, I just want to check / call.

      Piosolver answer:
      Pio likes a big bet size over a small one too

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      On the turn Pio actually has you moving all in with AA as played.
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      I personally find this interesting, I think that after the bet on the turn you're PSR is small so I guess this makes sense.

      anyways as played. here is the river.
      Yeah, as suspected you have to call it off.
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      • jamtay317
        jamtay317 commented
        Editing a comment
        GodsBigToe do you understand the result of the turn?

    • #5
      Yeah I agree with jamtay317 here all the way. I too would size up on the flop. KQ, Jx, Tx, 89s and then some suited paint hands with gutters and backdoor flushes are coming along for a fat size. Might even have some small percentage of sneaky QQ and KK that didnt 4 bet. I too hate the format of this and cant really tell what stacks were to start or how much you have behind here. Considering this is small stakes, I would likely be going ham on the flop to get call by most of the above range that would be 3betting us and still paying off. So for that reason I am 4betting flop most of the time. If we did get to a turn I am jamming (assuming the stack to pot ratio makes sense) because all of the above range is still going to come along as well. We now only lose to 89s, JJ and TT. Not a very big range to be scared of and pick up more hands we can get called by with the backdoor diamonds and i dont want to have to freeze up when bad cards come for either of us on river. As played, never folding river. If they have a set or 89 then I am it is what it is. REBUY TABLE 6!


      • #6
        Thanks for the replies guys. Sorry about the way I presented the hand. Maybe I’ll try out a replayer next time, this way was just simpler for me rather than having to the action out in detail. (I didn’t include the sizes because it would have revealed the villains hand but if you add up to his all in it’s there. Anyway I should have mentioned it was 100bb effective, my fault for that).
        And if anyone’s curious he did show up with JJ. I feel better calling it off seeing that everyone else would have but I still don’t know, players these days seems competent enough to know when someone has aces and also competent enough to not try and bluff them off it. That’s why my original title was “aces out of position sucks” lol
        Last edited by; 01-05-2020, 01:42 AM.